Transcript - S1 Ep1: The Composers
[MUSIC - "TWO THOUGHTS" BY AUGUSTA READ THOMAS]
Augusta Read Thomas:
My name is Augusta Read Thomas, and I'm a composer. When I was a little girl, I used to lie underneath the piano. We had an old rickety piano and my mom taught kindergarten. She was an amateur pianist and she would come home from her teaching day and play a little bit. And I remember being so attracted to that and hearing all the sounds surround me and wanting to touch that music and to make it. And I was like three or four. Little girl. And then I remember reaching over the edge of the piano with my two little fingers, like reaching up and going, [imitating piano sounds] "plink!" you know, and "plunk!" or something like this and "I made a sound!" You know, and then I used to always go to the piano when I would come home from school, I would just go and sit there and touch it and make up little sounds. And my piano teacher was noticing I was making up all these things. So she said, well, "make up a song for next week." So I would make up a song and it would be like two notes, like "plink! Plunk!". But it was a song to me. And then she said, "great! Great! Next week, make up another song." So little-by-little was good teaching because it got me, you know, moving my hands around. And then I started to learn how to write it down and with all the notes upside down and all the wrong notes written and the whole thing, but it was just part of my whole vibe.
[MUSIC - "SELENE" BY AUGUSTA READ THOMAS]
So basically I've been making sound my whole life in my own body, not only as a soloist at the piano, but then a trumpet player in an ensemble, and then a singer in a choir, and then a plucked instrument. So that when I write music for this wonderful project with Miller Theatre, I'm bringing that kind of artistic sensibility.
Intro:
This is Mission: Commission [intro]
Melissa Smey:
Welcome to Mission: Commission, a podcast demystifying the process of how classical music gets made. I'm your host, Melissa Smey, and I'm the Artistic Director of Miller Theater at Columbia University. At Miller Theatre, we commission new music by world-class composers; bringing joy, reflection, and curiosity to listeners. When people are true collaborators, deep and meaningful collaborators, you can feel that energy in the room. And that's at the heart of my practice as a curator. It's what I strive to illuminate for audiences. Every time we put a project on the Miller Theatre stage in New York City, you as the audience can experience that. And then somehow, take that home with you. But now we're living through a pandemic, and we've lost the stage. And while the stage is amazing and lovely, and the physical coming together is important. The magic of the music is that it can still bring us together. And that experiencing that connection can still happen. This podcast is about that spirit of connection. For me, it's incredibly joyful and at the heart of what I do.
On Mission: Commission, we're following the creative journey of three composers as they create vibrant new works of classical music. Join us on this mission to discover illuminating and personal moments beyond our concert stage in New York City and into your ears, wherever you are. Over a period of six weeks, I'll talk to Augusta Read Thomas in Chicago,
Augusta Read Thomas:
"I'm completely obsessed with music."
Melissa Smey:
Marcos Balter in New York,
Marcos Balter:
"Among the most daunting and thrilling things, you know, it's finding a new way to collaborate with people the way that I like to collaborate."
Melissa Smey:
And Courtney Bryan in New Orleans.
Courtney Bryan:
"Something that's very important to me as an artist is that every project is an exploration of something new."
Melissa Smey:
Week by week, we'll hear how Gusty, Marcos, and Courtney think and work on their music and how their creative process comes together and sometimes falls apart. So let's get started.
Augusta Read Thomas known by many as "Gusty" is a composer, musician, educator, mentor, and a huge contributor in the field of classical music. And she's a dynamo of tireless energy and relentless optimism. Gusty is writing a piece for solo percussionist, John Corkill.
Augusta Read Thomas:
I decided to write a piece that probably will be in two contrasting movements with two different percussion sets of colors. And at the moment I'm working on the one for solo vibraphone and crotales. Crotales are these beautiful, ringing, high bells, and vibraphones, of course, are also metal bells [musical phrase on vibraphone]. I started to think about resonance. Because the beautiful ringing of these bells and how they would overlap with one another if held, let's say in the pedal of a piano, and of course the vibraphone also has a pedal so you're able to build these harmonies. And I just spent a lot of time thinking about that and building chords. Each chord moving to the next. Thinking about long-term voice leading, short-term voice leading, upper voice leading, inner lines, a sense of momentum. Where is it hanging in the air? Where is it mysterious? Where is it driving forward with a flurry of bells? What happens after that? As I was working at these harmonies, I kept returning to one bell. And as I went on, I kept thinking of this as like a cosmic bell. Like we ring that bell and then there's sort of a chord or maybe two, and then we come back, and we keep coming back, and coming back. So the piece ends up feeling very kind of ceremonial to me as if we're meditating on this one space and then spinning around with all kinds of harmonies and colors and moods.
Melissa Smey:
That's beautiful. And so I want to go back one step. So the interesting thing about this project is that it's twofold, really, right? So we're commissioning you to compose a new piece, a new musical work, in a fairly short timeframe of about six weeks. And then at the same time, we're asking you to have a series of conversations with me about the creative process and to, kind of, give some insight for listeners into your process of creating music. And so I'd love to hear you tell us about what you find both most daunting and most thrilling about the beginning of this project.
Augusta Read Thomas:
The creative process for me always starts with improvisation. And as I've said for probably 35 years, I think of my music as captured improvisations. Because I'm at the piano, I'm playing them, I'm singing them, I'm dancing them; I'm trying to feel them, embody them, scatting them. And then I find something and I think "that's interesting! That could be good!" And then I find something else and I think, "Oh, that's terrible! That's derivative. It's junk." But little by little, you settle into something. And you realize that this material has its own inner life. And you can hear that in a piece that's well crafted. That comes from its own sense. Not every piece can do everything. You know, you have a vibraphone and some crotales. Like, you can't write a symphony. So what is it that this piece is about and what are those materials and how are they unraveling, as it were, into this network or a gestalt of meaning? For me, there's lots of layers that go into this. And it's a very organic process. I always am staying with the sound, with the notes, with the material that I'm working with for that particular piece. And then little by little as the piece progresses, it becomes very, very specific. You know, like exact notes, exact harmonies, flow, flux, density, counterpoint, harmony, you know, and on, and on, and on. At least for myself, if I go through that journey from that initial spark, like lighting a match, and then just improvise and work myself all the way around through the process, the piece can come out as a reflection of my character, or my soul, or my individuality, as opposed to some kind of composition exercise.
Melissa Smey:
I'm curious, at what point would you say, is there any point in your process, where there's a visual component? I'm thinking particularly of the beautiful illustrated, kind of, diagram that you'd made of your piece "Selene", which we'd worked on together at Miller, and it's a double quartet for percussion quartet and string quartet.
[MUSIC - "SELENE" BY AUGUSTA READ THOMAS]
And it just, I mean, it's a beautiful work of art on its own, but then the way that it illustrates gestures and feelings and the arc and shape of that piece. And so I'm curious when, and if, that is it component of when you're working on a piece.
Augusta Read Thomas:
When I compose music, there are many tools, I guess I could say, that I use. One of them is the piano, one of them is my body, one of them is singing, one of them is drawing pictures, one of them might be dancing around my apartment or, you know, jumping, go getting a cup of coffee and, like, doing it in the rhythm of the piece that I'm writing across the living room and so forth. And one of the things that I care a lot about is that the duration of a piece and its form are in good synchronization. So that the amount of material I'm making, if it needs to be a three-minute piece, that's the right amount of material for a three minute piece. It's not three minutes of material put into a 26 minute piece or 26 minutes of material put into a two minute piece. And so there's this very, very precarious balance between content and form. And I've always felt that form conserves energy. So when I am composing, I will often draw maps of the form. Like, what am I building here? How long is this piece? And what's happening in it? What, where are the arcs? What are the phrases? Are the phrases getting longer? Are they getting shorter? Where is that cosmic bell coming in? When does it come in? How often does it come in? So, I find it very helpful to kind of map out where I am in a piece. Now these are very messy. These are just like scribbles. But I think that I want a listener when they hear my piece to feel that every 15 seconds was needed. I don't want to waste a listener's time. And that's why I'm constantly interested in this balance between content and form.
Melissa Smey:
Thank you so much for making the time, Gusty. I'm really truly grateful. Thank you.
Augusta Read Thomas:
Thank you so much, Melissa. It's such a pleasure to be with you, and I want to express my gratitude to you and to Columbia University and to Miller Theatre for including me in your wonderful project.
[MUSIC - "ETERNAL REST" BY COURTNEY BRYAN]
Melissa Smey:
Our next composer in this episode is Courtney Bryan. Courtney writes music that really connects with listeners. Her music certainly connects with me. It's personal and moving, and it combines so many influences -- jazz and gospel. And it's influenced by her upbringing with church music and deep spirituality. Her music opens my ears to different possibilities, and allows me to listen to classical music in a different way. Courtney Bryan writes music that doesn't sound like anybody else's music. For this commission, Courtney is writing a piece for herself on piano, and trombonist, Andrae Murchison.
Courtney Bryan:
Okay. I'm very excited about this project. At the moment, I'm thinking about calling it "Synchronicity." It's a chance to kind of build a piece based on some things I've been thinking about in general when it comes to collaborating with others. But in particular, in this situation it's with a musician named Andrae Murchison. And so it's really exciting to just try something new and something that's, you know, new for both of us.
Melissa Smey:
So Courtney, tell me — why "Synchronicity" and what does that mean to you?
Courtney Bryan:
So I think about this a lot. I was thinking about it, as far as collaboration a couple of years ago, I worked on a piece with Sharan Strange, the poet, Sharan Strange, and also with the vocalist, Helga Davis. And it was a piece about Sandra Bland.
[MUSIC - "YET UNHEARD" BY COURTNEY BRYAN]
And one thing that kept happening between the three of us were all of these moments where we would just be on the same page about stuff kind of mysteriously, or even with the project, just meeting people at the right time, or everything was going according to a rhythm that wasn't, like, under any of our control. It felt like we were brought together. And so I just remember Sharan kept saying "synchronicity!", like every time something would happen between her and Helga, or her and me. And so I thought about it since then, but in particular with Andrae and I there's a lot of synchronicity just as far as our connection as people. It seemed to me like, "oh! This is a chance to actually have that, it's not just like a side thought. It's like, we're actually building a piece." So, yeah. So it's nice to just build a piece like starting from synchronicity and think about how a process can come out of that.
Melissa Smey:
And so tell us a little bit more about Andrae and also about his role in this piece.
Courtney Bryan:
Sure. So Andrae and I have known each other about 20 years now. We were at Oberlin Conservatory together. And so during that time we collaborated all the time. Like we were in bands together and we did our, like, junior and senior recitals together. So there's a lot of collaboration back then, and we've remained friends a long time, but we haven't actually collaborated musically since that time period. We've had very different kinds of music trajectories. And so kind of bringing all of that into this piece it's really exciting. But there's a lot of things in common we have, as far as our approach to music. Thinking about spirituality is, like, a core part of our process and also, like, our Southern heritages.
Melissa Smey:
So this is an interesting project because we are commissioning a new piece in a fairly short timeframe, six weeks. And then we're also documenting that creative process in a series of conversations that we're having together. The beginning of any project is an exciting time, but are there parts of it that maybe also feel a little daunting?
Courtney Bryan:
I guess the daunting thing is to stay on task. Like, I think that's always a daunting thing where anything is, like, to be regular about something and to; because some weeks, you know how it is, with the creative process, sometimes you're really in it and you feel like, "okay, this week I'm having so many ideas" and another week might happen or another week or two and things just feel very stagnant. And so I'm kind of aware that even within the six weeks there might be such a variation in each week, just depending on what's going on or, like, where my mind is, but the challenge will be to still keep it regular, to still, like, share whether it's joy or frustration or just confusion.
Melissa Smey:
And so let's take a step back. How would you describe your creative process, very broadly speaking?
Courtney Bryan:
I know that two things that are very important for me are improvisation and collaboration. But I have different ways of creating. Sometimes if I'm not collaborating with other musicians or other artists, I may just spend a lot of time, if it's just me writing a piece, say I'm writing a piece for orchestra and it's me, there's no, like, direct collaboration and everything on the page is completely notated for the musicians ahead of time, like, if I'm writing that style, I still find myself collaborating with, like, history or something or, you know, I'm, like, a lot of times I have influence from either poetry, some sort of writing, visual art, something, or stories from history. So, you know, it's not that same kind of collaboration, but I always have to be in conversation with something or someone to get like the creativity going.
Melissa Smey:
And so you and Andrae are going to be working in two different cities. Tell me about how you imagine you'll be collaborating remotely.
Courtney Bryan:
Yeah. So we're still figuring that out. He's in Savannah, Georgia, and I'm here in New Orleans, Louisiana. I think we're figuring that out. One thing I thought about since we're both very into numbers is maybe picking certain times of the day that we maybe record a musical idea and then we can share it with each other and just kind of see like how the ideas relate or don't relate. I think being in different cities, it could be nice to just kind of, like, have some sort of schedule loosely formed, but some sort of schedule of how we create ideas and share. And I guess, and it's interesting because I guess my role is composer on the project, but we're also creating the material together. So it's very collaborative in the material. And then I guess at some point I'll find some way to form it into like a final version of a piece, I guess.
Melissa Smey:
Yeah. So if you had to, if you had to kind of put it on a scale in terms of, if you envision how this project with Andrae will evolve, and kind of between the poles of, do you have a roadmap laid out or is it wide open at this moment where in between those two spaces, would you assess that it is right now at the beginning?
Courtney Bryan:
Let's see, if wide open is ten, and predetermined is one, maybe we're like at eight.
Melissa Smey:
Okay. Yeah.
Courtney Bryan:
So wide open. I say that because we do have the, according to the commission, we have certain things in place, like the duration of the piece, and also the fact that, you know, the instrumentation. And I think those are the things that we have that I expect and everything else is very wide open.
Melissa Smey:
I love it. And so thinking about how we are all of us globally in the midst of a pandemic, which has been devastating and terrible, I'm curious how you are finding this process, you know, trying to compose remotely. I imagine there are a lot of things that are more difficult, but on the flip side, is there anything that's easier?
Courtney Bryan:
It's interesting to me that there's so much that is digital. And so how do you still have intimacy with people you're close to over a screen and like be able to share like important moments and still be like your full self and not feel like you're, you know, not feel like different than you would in person? Which is, it is still different, but I think there's just so much of that. So I think that's definitely going into the creative process, the whole practice over the past few months of being able to be socially together while being physically distant is part of this.
[MUSIC - "DUST TO DUST" FROM "REQUIEM" BY COURTNEY BRYAN]
Melissa Smey:
It will be beautiful if you are able to bring that into the piece, right? And find ways for people to still continue to feel connected by and through your music, even though they won't be able to experience it in person together, live.
Courtney Bryan:
Yeah, I agree.
Melissa Smey:
Courtney. I'm so glad you said yes. I'm so glad you're willing to go on this journey with us. I'm really excited about it.
Courtney Bryan:
Thank you so much. I'm really excited. Thank you for, I know it was like one of those things where I was like, "oh! This is such a unique project! I gotta get involved!" This is really exciting.
[CONT. MUSIC - "DUST TO DUST" FROM "REQUIEM" BY COURTNEY BRYAN]
Melissa Smey:
And now our last composer in this series, Marcos Balter.
[MUSIC - "CODEX SERAPHINIANUS" BY MARCOS BALTER. ]
Marcos writes for people, not instruments or ensembles. And he spends time really getting to know the musicians he's writing for. There's something so beautiful about the give and take in that relationship. Marcos is writing a piece for solo harpist, Parker Ramsay.
Marcos Balter:
So yes, I'm really excited to write a piece for solo harp for Parker for a variety of reasons. First of all, I've never written for a solo harp. I've used harp in quite a lot of works, but I've never really worked exclusively on, you know, harp as a solo instrument. Secondly, because Parker is a fantastic musician, amazing musician, that I've been sort of dying to write for. And thirdly, because he's also a highly collaborative person. So that is a wonderful mix that I'm hoping that will counterbalance all the obstacles, all the hurdles that 2020 has posed on us.
Melissa Smey:
Thinking about the beginning of projects, and about the beginning of this project in particular, tell us a bit about what you find most daunting, most thrilling about this project you're about to embark on.
Marcos Balter:
I mean, everything is daunting and thrilling this year, right? So among the most daunting and thrilling things, you know, it's finding a new way to collaborate with people the way that I like to collaborate. Which, you know, sort of traditionally translates into close proximity, experimentation, and how to do that now, when this is not possible. Which I, you know, I honestly don't know how that will go. You know, of course that we can do things via Zoom, but, you know, any sort of telematic way of communicating, the sound quality is always the first thing to get compromised. And a lot of my music, you know, really sort of dwells on the subtleties of a specific instrument.
[MUSIC - "DREAMCATCHER" BY MARCOS BALTER]
So getting that subtlety through this kind of platform is going to be challenging, to say the least. And the other thing is the nature of the project itself, you know, that we have a very finite time to do all those things, you know. So it's a little bit like the music British Baking Show. It's like, "go, go, go!" And trying to use that as a way of stimulating new ways of thinking creatively. Can be fun, but can also be terrifying.
Melissa Smey:
And at the outset, how are you finding the prospect of talking about the creative process? So we'll be having these regular conversations in real time as you're creating the piece. And so I'm curious to hear you talk about what it will be like talking about your creative process.
Marcos Balter:
That's always something really scary, you know, because I think that this kind of documentation of a project is, by nature, narrative. And by narrative, I mean linear. And I find that my process is completely non-linear. I mean, it's not unusual for me to have a very solid idea about something and keep building on that solid idea and then getting, you know, a week before I have to finish and looking at everything and saying, “this is horrible”, and throwing everything away and starting from scratch. Or, you know, jumping back and forth between ideas. It's a little intimidating to have to be held accountable on telling the story, you know, every week, when that story might be completely disjunct. But I will try my best.
Melissa Smey:
I so appreciate your willingness to take the leap with us on this. You know, it's a somewhat arbitrary time constraint, this idea that we're giving ourselves six weeks for you all to create the pieces and then for us to document the process. I'm curious how that compares to your process in general. You know, if it's not linear, and therefore not time-based, is it that, you know, the composition of a work could take a year? That it could take a few months? I'm curious how this compares to what you would envision as your typical practice.
Marcos Balter:
Well, it's funny because my typical "practice", and I'm going to put practice here in parenthesis, but my typical way of working, I guess, is even if I know of, you know, a piece for a very long time, the act of writing, itself, usually happens in a really compact time span. And that is not to say that I'm procrastinating until the deadline, although that has happened before, but it's more that I need to let ideas marinate in my head. You know, and really be thinking about the instrumentation, thinking about the people, thinking about what I have to say within that intersection of instrumentalist and instrument. And that takes a lot of time. That is actually the largest bulk of what composing is for me. You know, to be able to walk, and eat, and sleep on the idea, you know, for as long as it takes until there's these sort of vague sounds start to, or vague ideas, start building in my head. And that little kernel kind of grills into what the idea may be. And then, you know, sort of dreaming about what does it look like? You know, what is the notation? Is there a notation for this? And trying to imagine the performers sort of embodying those things and what does that look like, as well? And how does the whole thing manifest? So there's a lot of abstraction that precedes sitting at my table with a piece of paper. But then when I do sit at my table, the process, itself, is very waterfall-like. It just kind of goes, and tends to go rather fast. So it's not unusual for me if I have a year to spend about 10 months thinking very hard and doing research, and reading, and looking at all of that. And then two months of go, go, go, go; sweat, blood, and tears. And then it happens. It's really not that different from sort of like a true gestation, right? I would, sort of, think of the thinking of the project, you know, as the majority of gestation and the writing of the project as really the, sort of, like the idea of giving birth. I feel weird about saying that because I have no idea of what is the experience of giving birth. But if I had to imagine, you know, a parallel to this, sort of gestational process, that will be the closest to it, from what I've heard.
Melissa Smey:
So thinking now that we are in the midst of a pandemic, everything's remote, we know that there are a lot of things that are more difficult. There's no question. Is there anything that is easier?
Marcos Balter:
No. You know, it's really funny because I've been in a few panels recently in which the panels go is to talk about your life after the pandemic, and new ways of, you know, imagining music making, and what have we learned about it. And I'm always really afraid of romanticizing a plague. So I've been really resistant to the idea that I have to change my human ways, you know, as to accommodate something that should not elicit accommodation. I miss live music. I miss, you know, the ways in which our community operates. Even though it is flawed in some aspects, but I do miss it. So in a way I don't want to get too good at this. You know, this is all temporary. I keep calling this period "The Big Temporary." And I keep seeing a lot of what is being done and discussed as necessary debris. We need to continue working, but a lot of what we're doing right now, perhaps will go away. Perhaps will disappear. And that's okay. You know, I think that that kind of purge is not necessarily a bad thing, but I'm afraid of looking at this, looking at something that has caused so much literal destruction as something advantageous. So I just don't go there.
Melissa Smey:
Yeah. When I was thinking about the reasons why I wanted to work with you on this project, the kind of inherent collaboration, and the spirit of collaboration, that you bring to all of your relationships was a big reason why I wanted to work together. And it was a lot of fun doing a Composer Portrait together. And then one of the kind of opportunities/challenges, one of the things that I still haven't entirely reconciled, is the inherent theatricality in your music,
[MUSIC - "DEATH OF PAN" BY MARCOS BALTER]
…and the inherent drama in presentations, live presentations of your music.
And it's so evocative, and it's just, it captures and captivates the listener. And so it will be interesting to see over the course of the development of this piece, and then when we have an opportunity to listen to it, how that fits into your broader work and the work that you have created. That's one that was interesting for me. And I thought about it a lot when I was thinking about asking you to be a part of the project. Because you, and you've spoken about it in the past about how that is such an important component of your work. And so I'm curious if at this outset, if you have any thoughts about that.
Marcos Balter:
Absolutely. So when I talked to you initially, I remember that one of my first questions was, is this video? Is this audio? Like, what is this? Like, what is the experience? You know? And when you told me that it was going to be audio, the task became even more daunting. You know, because it's yet another sense that goes away. So we don't have proximity and we don't have visual. So the experience has to be understood aurally and aurally only. And then, you know, like that frames things in a completely different way. How do I create an experience that is interesting, depending, exclusively on one sense? You know? Having, and understand that people are to experience it most likely from their homes with headphones, most likely, you know. Like all of those things then become quote-unquote, "the venue", right? Become the place itself in thinking of the place, trying to imagine what the place is, is really important to me. Of course, we have recordings of things that we've done for live performances. But we understand those recordings as a representation of something that had happened. In this case, the representation IS the thing. And yeah, it takes a completely different mindset, and looking at what we would usually think of as the remains of the real event as the event itself.
Melissa Smey:
Yes. Well, I so appreciate you taking the leap with us and saying yes.
Marcos Balter:
Oh, I'm super excited. This is going to be super challenging, but I think I'm game. And I'm so glad, and I'm so honored to be part of this.
Melissa Smey:
Hooray!
[MUSIC - "DREAMCATCHER" BY MARCOS BALTER]
That's it for today's episode. On the next episode of Mission: Commission, we'll hear about the musicians our composers are working with and more about their collaboration.
Mission: Commission is a production of Miller Theatre at Columbia University.
Major support for Mission: Commission is provided by the Francis Goelet Charitable Lead Trusts and the National Endowment for the Arts. Support for Miller Theatre is provided by the New York State Council on the Arts with the support of governor, Andrew M. Cuomo, and the New York State Legislature, and the Howard Gilman Foundation. Support for contemporary music is provided by the Aaron Copland Fund for Music and the Amphion Foundation.
This episode was produced by Golda Arthur and me, with Adrienne Stortz, Lauren Cognetti, and Taylor Riccio. Erick Gomez is our sound designer and engineer.
This episode featured audio excerpts of pieces written by Augusta Read Thomas, Courtney Bryan, and Marcos Balter. Visit missioncommissionpodcast.com for a full listing of pieces, performers, and recordings included in this and every episode.
If you enjoy this podcast, please subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and, even better, leave a review on Apple Podcasts. It really helps the show. Thanks for listening. See you next week!
